Dangerous Alliances: “The New Axis Is Iran, Russia and China”

Audio By Carbonatix

Published: March 14, 2022 | Date of Source Audio: March 11, 2022

Transcribed and modified for publication from the original audio program

Hugh Hewitt discusses Ukraine and the realities of tyranny with Dr. Larry Arnn

Hugh Hewitt: Dr. Arnn … we have to be prudent. We have to take our actions, our direction in the United States, based upon what we can really accomplish and on the national security interest of Americans. And the lesson last week was, build more weapons right now. Do you realize they are actually proposing to take the amount that we give to Ukraine out of our defense budget? The Democrats are? The party of Kennedy has fallen apart.

Dr. Larry Arnn: Yeah. See, just remember we are a deeply divided country. There are interesting things that both Putin and Xi of China have said about us. They think that we have a contagion.

Hewitt: Yes, they do.

Arnn: It's destroying us and they don't want it in their countries. Putin has compared radical liberalism, which is strong in America – it’s not dominant, but it's strong – to the things to which Russia succumbed in 1917 with the Bolshevik Revolution. And that means that they, those countries say, that they fear us because we may infect them with this. And see, that means that's not America, the light to the world. America is being shunned by tyrants. And they're tyrants, of course, and that's, you know, terrible people, but they may be right about that point.

“What does all this mean for Taiwan?”

And see, our weakness – and it comes from the divisions in our politics, which are very serious. So, one thing to think about this – it’s a very important thing to think about – is what does all this mean for Taiwan? Because China is apparently poised to go. Taiwan is an old friend, it's populated. It was settled by the people who lived there already and by the people who escaped from Mao and the anti-Communist forces that were defeated, by the way, with the help of Stalin. And that's where the semiconductor industry is centered. I mean, more of it, I think, in Taiwan than in China, but certainly very much of it there. And it's interesting, those big Taiwanese companies – especially Taiwan Semiconductor, I think is the name of it – they're building big plants in the United States now –  

Hewitt: Arizona –

Arnn: And they're worried. Right. And so it is important to deter this, if we can, as a lesson to China… So, there are two things that come to mind. And the first is you have to be on the side of the Ukrainians, right? They're just, you know, they have a right to govern themselves. Everyone does. The second thing is there may be a powerful American interest to do as much as we can – if, especially – it impresses Xi. But of course, that's an imponderable, right? Because maybe what this is going to do is further drive the Russians into the hands of the Chinese and they are aligned with them now. And that is a dangerous alliance to us.

Hewitt: In fact, as I left for Hawaii, the report was coming out that Chinese companies are scrambling, eager to serve as middlemen to circumvent Western sanctions, acquire the imports Russian businesses need, and then transact them, because we're afraid of China, Dr. Arnn. The new axis is Iran, Russia and China, and that's the reality of the world. And we are, I think, we're just replaying Britain in the early ‘30s and middle ‘30s, when they were exhausted. Right?

“We're at half the level of the Navy that we need for the world in which we live.”

Arnn: Seems to me, that's right. And you know, by the way, are you going to have effective sanctions on China when Germany is the strong – I’m sorry, in Italy – when Germany is the strongest power in Europe? They didn't work. Right? And we forget that we're not as strong as we were. And that was bound to happen, by the way, because of the rise of China, because it's a very big place and very productive. I would guess, by the way, that if challenged – that is to say, if we got our house in order and grew our economy and let people live in peace and freedom – that would put a lot of pressure on them. And there is a lot of pressure on them because you always have to remember in the back of your mind that tyrannies have trouble sustaining themselves because people don't like it. And it's as old as Aristotle. And then he goes on to say in Book V of “The Politics,” he says, how do they sustain themselves? Because once in a while, they last a long time. Mostly they don't. And it's just chilling when you read it. It's just a portent of “1984” in the modern totalitarian novels. He says they do it by basically dehumanizing their citizens. They break them up into bits, they refuse friendship, they don't let associations grow, and they're constantly under observation. Well, that's what China is doing to the maximum extent it can to its people.

Hewitt: And we see in Russia the ruthless arrest – I will never forget the arrest and brutal treatment of a survivor of the siege of Leningrad, now St. Petersburg, a little old babushka lady in Leningrad, now St. Petersburg, being hustled off by Putin’s thugs because she was holding a sign declaiming against the invasion of Ukraine. He is a dictator. …

Arnn: … I think Putin is actually in a fragile situation if we deploy the remaining economic arsenal of America and the West as is happening, led by Europeans. But we're holding back. The Europeans have delisted their companies, they've crashed the ruble, they've seized the yachts. We're doing everything like two weeks after the Europeans do it, when we're shamed into it. And the private sector is showing Russia as well. It's not got anything to do with kinetic combat. It's got everything to do with morals.

Arnn: That's true. And by the way, these things that you can do in the international banking system are very formidable.

Hewitt: Yes, they are.

Arnn: And you know, one might fear them a little bit. But they repealed the law that ultimately, the power is the power to harm or kill. And what does it take to be a strong nation? Any entity, any organism, Hillsdale College – what does it take to be strong? It needs to be very good at its work. And it needs to generate for support for that work as it goes along. That's why the free market is so powerful. It enlists everyone in the strength of the nation at the same time as they serve their own interest. China has found an innovative way to kind of harness some of that. And yet they're, you know, it's always there – how much do we let go and how much do we keep control? And it's a balance, and it's a difficult balance for them. And that’s why I think under pressure, they will prove to be weaker than they seem.

Hewitt: But it requires pressure.

Arnn: And that means we need to be strong, right? We need not to be head over heels in debt. We need our economy to grow. We need taxes to be low. And, you know, if you just look at the Constitution of the United States, what is the federal government for? There are 17 clauses in Article 1, Section 8, and nine of them concern national defense. And we're spending more money than we've ever spent. And we don't have enough ships, right?

Hewitt: We don't even have close to enough ships.

Arnn: Right!

Hewitt: We're at half the level of the Navy that we need for the world in which we live.

Arnn: That's it. And just remember that fact. That's a change in the world of fundamental import. And it's what makes possible this mess in the Ukraine.